Episode Transcript
[00:00:01] Speaker A: Hey, it's Jonathan and all the guys with Chosen Road. We are driving down the road and we just want to tell you you are listening to the last episode of the Recovering Fundamentalist podcast.
[00:00:10] Speaker B: It has been an absolute honor for us to be a part of the RFP podcast for quite some time now. And, man, I'll tell you what, we have listened to many, many podcasts driving many, many miles to go sing about Jesus, and we are going to miss the podcast. And we thank you guys so much for letting us be a part of part of the RFP Fam.
[00:00:30] Speaker A: We want to leave you all with one final song, and we pray that it is a blessing and an encouragement. It is a song of salvation that we hope will save the soul.
[00:00:40] Speaker B: Let's go.
[00:00:41] Speaker C: If there's hair on your ear.
[00:00:54] Speaker D: You'Ll.
[00:00:54] Speaker C: Live a life of fear and dread with a tangled mess upon your head if your hair's too long if your hair's too long there's sin in your heart Sin your heart if your hair's too long if your hair's too long, there's sin in.
[00:01:18] Speaker D: Your heart.
There are moments in life you never forget.
Moments that leave a mark.
Not because of the spotlight or the numbers or the noise, but because of the journey, the people, the pain, the laughs, the healing.
And this.
This is one of those moments.
Five and a half, almost six years ago, we sat in front of a microphone not knowing what this would become.
We didn't have a roadmap, didn't have a platform. We didn't have all the answers. Honestly, we were just trying to tell the truth, to say out loud what so many of us have been keeping buried for years, and to give a voice to the voiceless.
We started this podcast because we knew we needed to give a voice to so many who just couldn't put into words what they were feeling.
We were asking hard questions about faith and God, church, legalism, and everything that we were taught not to question.
But I never imagined what would happen next.
Somehow, this little podcast turned into something so much bigger.
It became a lifeline, mirror and a movement.
You showed up, you listened, you shared your story, you found your voice. And together, we started walking in freedom. Oh, we've laughed until we couldn't breathe. We have cried over wounds that still haven't fully healed. In some cases.
We've had hard conversations. We've lost friends, and we have made new ones.
Man, we even made it through a global pandemic together.
But more than anything, we learned that grace is real and that Jesus is better. Than man made religion, and that there is life on the other side of emotionalism and legalism and man made ideology preached as the word today is episode number 200, the Final Chapter of the Recovering Fundamentalist Podcast.
I'll be honest, that's hard to say out loud because this, this just isn't the end of a show.
It's the end of a season, the end of an era.
And for me, it's deeply personal.
All the way back in 2007, I was a sophomore in college, sitting at the funeral of Dr. Lee Roberson. Because of my role the last few years of Dr. Roberson's life, I was one of the four that got to drive him around, pick him up in the morning, bring him to school, take him to pick up dry cleaners to get his hair cut. And so because of that, I got to sit up with the elite, if you will.
I heard some very influential men in the IFB say at the end of that funeral, this is the death of fundamentalism.
I remember sitting there on that bench on the third row on the left hand side as a sophomore in college and I prayed a prayer. God, I don't know what it would look like, but I would love to play a role in bringing some life and reformation to the IFB and y'. All. I feel like in some small way, God has answered that prayer.
I'm not here today to mourn something that's ending. I'm here to celebrate what's been, to say thank you to some folks, to honor the journey ultimately, to thank you for walking it with me, walking it with us.
So before we go any further, before I say anything else, I want to say the words that have carried me through some of the hardest, most beautiful, most transformative moments of my life in this last six years, one last time with everything I got.
Let's go.
[00:05:15] Speaker E: You are listening to the Recovering Fundamentalist Podcast, where faith and real life collide in a world full of noise, division, and debate. We're here to cut through the clutter with honest conversations, bold truth, and a whole lot of grace. Whether you're questioning, growing, or just trying to make sense of it all. You've got a seat at the table. Let's join JC Groves for today's episode.
Let's go.
[00:05:53] Speaker D: The Recovering Fundamentalist podcast starts in three. You know what makes women stupid is calling. Jesus was not a bartender.
You have lost your mind.
[00:06:05] Speaker F: Long tongue. Heifers have given me a lot more trouble than heifers wearing britches.
[00:06:09] Speaker D: And you know that.
[00:06:10] Speaker F: Say amen right there.
[00:06:11] Speaker D: 1.
[00:06:12] Speaker F: Let me tell you something, bozo. They'll be selling Frosties in hell for this. Boy puts on a pair of pink underwear.
[00:06:19] Speaker D: Amen. I sucked my thumb till I was 14 years of age.
Well, here we are, episode number 200.
I'm your host, J.C. groves, and this one's going to be a little different.
No big guests line up. No deep dive into theology or fundamentalism or emotionalism.
No calling out legalism or man made ideology or even preference based preaching.
Just me, a mic, and all of you, the community that has carried this podcast for six years, let's be honest, some never thought we'd make it to episode number 200.
This started out as a way to vent, a way to heal, a way to process faith. After growing up in a system that told us questions were rebellion, freedom was dangerous.
Oh, but it became something so much more.
We have laughed together, we have cried together.
We've wrestled with hard truths, pushed back against legalism, called out spiritual abuse. And somewhere in the middle of all that, we found grace.
We found healing, and we have found family.
And we've had some really good times. I think back to all of the RFP fam meetups. Statesboro, Georgia. That was one of my favorite moments in my life. That was a special, special weekend.
Michigan Bourbon, Missouri. Danville, Virginia. Asheville, North Carolina. Here in Ringgold, Georgia. Man, we even went to Israel.
[00:07:58] Speaker G: Oh.
[00:07:58] Speaker D: To every guest that has sat down and shared their story, I want to thank you. Think about some of the guests that we've had on this podcast. Of course, Matt Dudley. He was also a host for a few episodes. Sam Jones, Phil and Paul Kidd. Of course, many of you started listening to the podcast because of our episodes with Phil Kidd. We've had the former president of the Southern Baptist Convention, Bart Barber, on Christiana Miller, our friend Dr. Marcus Merritt, Daniel Wynn, Jacob Kessling, Danny Hesterly, Chris Gopner, John Boubar, Tommy Sewell, Kyle gray, Shane Pruitt, Dr. Dave Lovis Douglas. I'm sorry. Dr. Steve Pettit, Ken Scott, Robbie Galady, Trevin Wax, Greg Steer with Dare to Share Ministries, Brandon Neal, Dr. Steven Boyce, Dr. Mark Milioni, Mission. Edu, Barnabas Piper, Jared C. Wilson, Benjamin Watson, John Cooper, Dr. Tim Lee. One of my favorite episodes, Jim Cymbala in in his office at the Brooklyn Tab. Of course, we had chosen Road On. You heard them at the start of this episode. They're some good friends of ours. We've had on Blake Long, Brian Drake, Reba Bowman, Jennifer Brantley, Jen Wilkins, Billy Mill, Dr. James White, Mike and Jen Peters. Bob and Kelly still can't say their last name. Josh Combs, Brandon Holt Rest in peace buddy. The great Chris McClarney, Mark Ward Hunter Strength. The original recovering fundamentalist Mark Lowry, Josh Tice, ed Young, Lois McNair, Josh Cardwell, Adam Tyson. Who could forget Nathan Rager. I wish I could.
We also had James McDonald on but we never aired that episode. And for good reason y'. All. We even had a non accounts on X Twitter back then. You remember that? Lloyd Legalist, Northwest Seminary Wrestling pastor, the loving pastor, the great IFB preacher clips, the OG bad preacher clips, and even Deacon Randy Ranger. But no one cares, right?
I want to take a moment to also honor the incredible voices that made up the RFP Network.
What started as a single podcast turned into a network of like minded leaders in conversations that reached even further.
To the Men of Valor Podcast, Eric Travis and even old Randall. I want to thank you for showing up and showing what Biblical strength and integrity looks like in a world that desperately needs it. To one of my favorites, Beers and Bible. Not just on the network, but even before and now, Anthony and Michael, you guys brought theology and authenticity to the table in a way that both is approachable and real. I've always appreciated your honest conversation and the way that you make space for hard questions as well as good beer. To the four Freedom Guys, Brett and James and even John, your commitment to religious liberty and clarity in the world of confusion has been both bold and needed. Also to the ladies at Grow and Grace, Shanna and Kristen, thank you for the grace filled perspective that you bring week after week. Your voices have and are giving hope and healing to so many people. Every one of you have helped carry the mission forward in your own unique way and I'm proud of what we have built together. I'm grateful for how you've helped people move from fundamentalism towards freedom, truth and even Jesus. And I am rooting you on. Even though we're not in network anymore, I'm still rooting you on and I'll be listening. I gotta show some love and some gratitude to the RFP fam Facebook group moderators Sheriff Chris and Allie Brown, Brett and Emily, Martin, Daniel and Ashley Wynn, Even the former moderators, the Lancasters, Lee, Lindy, Liu, Kelly Brewer, Josh Johnson, Clay, Bob and Kelly still can't say their name, last name and the Spurgeons. I want to thank you for being who you are. You helped create and protect a space for thousands of people where they could wrestle with questions, they could ask questions they could share stories, they could find community.
Listen. You carried the weight of the ministry in the comments, in the messages, in the quiet behind the scenes moments when people just needed to know they weren't alone.
You weren't just moderators. You were pastors, encouragers, and trusted voices to know that a group of people in some of the most tender, vulnerable seasons of their lives were experiencing hope. I know it wasn't always easy, but your faithfulness mattered more than you probably realized. Thanks for believing in the mission, for loving the RFP fam well, and for standing in the gap when people needed a safe place to land you. You provided that for them. I also want to thank Brett Martin again for his social media skills. He kept our TikTok running well. Cowboy Kyle and Sam Jones. They did a great job on two of the greatest intros in podcast history, in my opinion. We've used some great studios. J Radio, Studio 148 and Clint Pal. Those guys are awesome. I want to give a huge shout out to our Patreons, patrons of Patreon. These folks have helped keep the mission moving forward and I'm telling y', all, I'm going to share in just a minute. But what's coming next is bigger than just a podcast. It's a resource center, a community. A community, a movement. And I pray you would prayerfully consider staying on board. Even those of you that haven't yet jump on board. The best is yet to come. I'll tell you more about that here in just a minute. Can't forget Michelle McKibben with free life Soap. That woman kept us smelling good and clean for many years. Thank you Ms. Michelle. Go on over and buy some Free Life so you can still try to use the promo code rfp. I don't know if it works or not, but it's always worth a shot.
To my fellow co host who were with me for the majority of this journey, Brian Edwards, Nathan Cravat.
I want to take a moment and just say thank you.
What started with a 2am phone call to Nathan and an idea that pulled Brian in not long after turned into something far bigger than any of us expected.
The three of us set out with a shared mission and that was to help people break free from legalism and discover the freedom and hope that is found in Jesus.
For the first few years we locked arm in arm and gave it everything we had. Our time, our energy, our convictions and our stories.
We got real. We got raw, we got transparent.
We were in the trenches. We went to battle against the ifb, fraternity and man made ideology that was so prevalent.
Now, listen, it wasn't always smooth.
We didn't always agree. Those two fight like an old married couple.
But we showed up. We helped create something that sparked a movement, something that gave voice to the voiceless and has helped thousands, if not millions of people know they weren't crazy. They were just waking up to the truth.
The truth is, the journey didn't end the way that I hoped it would.
Over time, things have shifted in a lot of ways, I have felt left carrying something that we started together.
I really thought we'd be here, finishing side by side. But life changes. Seasons change. And even when it's hard to understand, that's okay.
And even with all that, I want to honor Brian and Nathan. You were an important part of this story. Without your voices in those early days, the RFP wouldn't have become what it is.
The reach, the response, the impact was bigger than any of us. And I'm thankful that we got to be a part of it together.
We may not be close anymore, and it may not have ended the way that I had pictured, but I still genuinely want to thank you.
Thank you for helping create something that mattered. Thank you for being part of the message that gave people permission to question, to heal, and to begin following Jesus in freedom.
You, too and Dudley were part of something significant.
And for that, I'm grateful.
To every listener who has sent a message, left a comment, or shared your journey, I want to say thank you, man. Even the critics. You're more likely blocked and probably won't even listen to this, but even you help sharpen us. So we want to thank you, too. And in the words of Matt Dudley, you. You all have made the RFP more than a podcast. You've made it a movement. Listen, this wasn't just us behind a microphone. This was you. The person who hit play while driving home from church wondering if anyone else had the same questions.
It was you who reached out with trembling voice to share your story for the very first time.
It was you who said, I thought I was the only one.
You who dared to hope again.
Every download, every share, every conversation, every tear filled email and phone call, it all built something that became bigger than any of us imagined.
Listen, friends, we weren't just telling stories. We were breaking silence.
We weren't just critiquing a system. We were calling people back to the heart of Jesus.
We weren't just recovering.
We were reclaiming our voice, our faith, and our freedom.
Over these last six years, I've seen people find the courage to leave abusive churches. I've seen marriages restored after years of religious pressure. We've watched men and women walk back into church, not out of obligation, but because they encountered grace again. Some for the first time.
And it wasn't because of a podcast. It was because what? You made it. You didn't just listen. You leaned in. You built community.
You created safe place for others to heal. This whole thing, the recovering fundamentalist podcast, it has never been about fame or numbers. It has always been about freedom. And you made that happen.
So when I say it became a movement, what I mean is you gave it life, you gave it meaning, you gave it momentum. And I will never stop being grateful for that. I know some of you are probably asking, well, why end the podcast now?
Well, the truth is, seasons change.
Life changes.
To be honest, this podcast has done exactly what it was created to do. It told the truth.
It helped people find freedom.
It gave a voice to those who thought that they were alone.
And it will continue to do that. All 200 plus episodes will still be available as long as people are clicking, play and listening.
But don't think for a second that this is the end.
I'm excited to announce that coming In January of 2026, I'll be launching a brand new podcast with a couple amazing new co hosts. A new name, new direction, new voices, but the same mission to help people walk in truth, to live in freedom and take their next steps following the way of Jesus. You see, I feel this deep burden, this deep desire to help you, help you not just find freedom from religion and legalism, but to give you the tools to live the abundant life that John 10:10 talks about.
Coming in 2026, it's not just a new podcast. It will be a resource platform to help you become more like Jesus. Together as we find the formations that will help us follow the way of Jesus. I'm excited to announce that coming In January of 2026, the following the Way podcast will be launching. Stay tuned as we get a little closer to the new year. To find out more details, y', all, I am so fired up for this. You can go to followingthewaypodcast.com here in just a few weeks and we will start having resources on there.
I'm telling you, it's going to be the RFP on steroids. We're not starting over.
We're building on what we started here. And I'm fired up.
Well, joining me on this final episode is someone who more than likely has not listened to A handful of the last 199 episodes, but she has lived every one of them out right beside me. She's been in the trenches, in the late night edits, the hard conversations, the celebrations, the criticism.
And through it all, she's been my steady, my support, my ride or die, my bride. Kim, babe, it only took you 200 episodes to get here solo, and here you are. No backup, no safety nets, just you and a mic. And so I'm. I'm curious, what's all your take on this? What. What's the journey look like from your side? And what would you want to say to the RFP fam, the folks who have walked with us on this road?
[00:21:24] Speaker G: Well, as we've been kind of processing over the last couple of weeks, the ending of this podcast, it kind of made me look back to the beginning of everything. And I remember the night driving home from Dallas, Texas, when you called Nathan.
[00:21:42] Speaker D: Yep.
[00:21:42] Speaker G: It was like, probably 2:00am or. I mean, it was very early in the morning.
[00:21:46] Speaker D: Morning. You were over there snoring.
[00:21:47] Speaker G: I was for a little bit. But y' all were just talking about this crazy idea of this podcast that would kind of call out the unbiblical things that y' all had been seeing for years, but nobody was talking about and would kind of just put a microphone in front of your faces to. To talk about these issues. And, I mean, even though y' all didn't know anything about podcasting or anything like that, you just kind of wanted to see a revolution in the IFB movement and kind of wanted to be able to call these things out and to give biblical truth for these. For this stuff. And so I didn't grow up around the ifb, so it was.
It was a culture shock for me very much.
I was definitely not prepared for the intense hate and the scrutiny that followed for the next five and a half years.
It was intense. It was.
I'm a people pleaser, and so I don't like to ruffle feathers. I like there to be peace on earth. I like everybody to get along.
And when you're doing this kind of thing, sometimes that's just not possible.
[00:23:05] Speaker D: And you married the complete opposite.
[00:23:07] Speaker G: It did. You did. And so it's been a huge, growing experience for me just to be able to stand by and watch.
I've seen you march into battle a lot of times alone, just marching through because you knew that the truth was on your side, that you had the Bible on your side. And you were marching through because you knew that that's what you needed. To do. And so you were always the one that they love to hate. I never understood that, but because I knew the real you, and you never were afraid to say the truth out loud. And that.
That makes people upset sometimes. And so. But I knew your heart behind it, and I knew the real you. And it was very hard for me when they said terrible things about you.
It killed me.
But I've definitely cried a lot of tears.
There's been a lot of tears involved in all this.
Not from you. It doesn't bother you. But me, it bothers me.
I feel everything very deeply. And so that part was very hard for me just to hear the. The terrible things people have said.
But I was. I was thinking. I was thinking about the other side.
[00:24:30] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:24:31] Speaker G: About the intense love and the healing that has come from all of this and the beautiful community that was built out of, like, this crazy idea. And it was. It's far outweighed all of the bad, all of the negative that's come out of it. It 100% has been amazing.
[00:24:58] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:25:00] Speaker G: The people that we got to meet that we would have never met any other way.
Never would I dream that we would just be in stores, random places, and people would just walk up and say they knew you and the podcast and it had made an impact on their life.
It's been crazy. The people that God has brought across our path, it's just been incredible.
The conferences and the fun things that we've been able to do together as the RFP fam have just been memories that we will cherish forever. I mean, they've just been awesome.
[00:25:36] Speaker D: And I think your first experience, really, with the whole ifb, and correct me if I'm wrong, but your first glimpse into, like, recovering from this stuff was our meetup in Statesboro.
[00:25:48] Speaker G: Yes. That was the first time I had kind of ever been around that, and it was just amazing. We were out in the middle of Bumbleville States Statesboro. We were out in the middle of everything. It was, like, in a barn or something, and we just cooked all this good food, and we were all together. And I remember we went to this little chapel thing that they had. It might. We might have had, like, maybe a guitar or something. And we just sang, and it was incredible. And it was a glimpse into the amazing family that was coming together and the amazing thing that was being built.
And it's just.
It's a once in a lifetime thing that we got to be a part of.
[00:26:31] Speaker D: Sure.
[00:26:31] Speaker G: And we will never, ever, ever take that for granted.
[00:26:36] Speaker D: So right here, right now, on the record, I'm curious, because I don't know this.
How many episodes of the Recovering Fundamentalist podcast have you listened to?
[00:26:48] Speaker G: Well, a lot of them I listen to when you're editing them and stuff, so it's not like I have.
[00:26:52] Speaker D: That's a cop out. How many have listened to.
[00:26:57] Speaker G: I would say probably 25 or 30.
[00:27:01] Speaker D: Unbelievable. Unbelievable.
[00:27:05] Speaker G: Sorry.
[00:27:06] Speaker D: Well, that's okay, because I'll be honest, I have not gone back and listened to hardly any of them because I hear them when we're recording it and then the edit, and I just don't go back and listen to it. So you've probably listened to more than I have.
[00:27:18] Speaker G: Yeah, I have. Well, and I listen to a lot of them. Like when you record them or like the ones in Vegas. I listened while you were recording them. I was actually there, you know, for a lot of them.
[00:27:28] Speaker D: At least two.
[00:27:31] Speaker G: Yeah.
[00:27:31] Speaker D: But anyways, so what would you say to the RFP fam? Many that you know and many that you don't, but they see our life on social media here on the podcast. I mean, there are many people that feel like they know you because. And the kids because of. You know, we've been very transparent here on the podcast. What would you say to the folks now that the RFP is ending and what's coming?
[00:27:52] Speaker G: Well, I would just say just a huge thank you to everyone because the RFP fam has gathered around us. They have gone to battle for us so many times as a family.
They have defended us, they have been loyal.
Your kindness and your friendship, it was not taken lightly, and it made all the difference in the world, and it made such an impact on our family and on me. And I know that this is not the end, that it's only the beginning, but it's from the bottom of my heart, I just want to say thank you to everyone.
Y' all have made every mile of this journey worth it, and we love you so much.
[00:28:41] Speaker D: That's it.
Look at there. You can do it. You can talk on a podcast.
It only took 200 episodes to get you on here by yourself.
[00:28:49] Speaker G: The best for last.
[00:28:50] Speaker D: Oh, there it is. Thanks, babe.
Before we close this out, I want to speak directly to the one that is still hurting, the. The one that's still in it. You're still trying to untangle faith from fear. I want you to hear me. You're not alone. You're not crazy. You're not beyond hope. There is real life on the other side of legalism. And I hope that what we have done Here on the Recovering Fundamentalist podcast will help you understand that there is a faith that's deep and honest and messy and beautiful. And you don't have to have it all figured out. You just got to keep on going. You know what my Hope is? In 20 years from now, someone finds this podcast and here's exactly what they need to keep going. That 15 years from now, we run into each other, like Kim said, and you share your story of how far you have come.
Ten years from now, you're walking in freedom and you've been seeing Jesus a real and anew in your life.
And whether you're just now tuning in, you're on episode five or 150 or 199, my prayer is the same. That you will discover the real and abundant life that Jesus talks about. Not a life bound by fear or shame, but a life filled with grace and freedom and the love of a God who will never let you go. Keep going. Freedom is real and it's waiting for you.
Well, friends, here we are. The end of an era. 200 episodes later, I still can't believe this happened 200 episodes ago. We were trying to find our way through the fog, trying to make sense of the wreckage of legalism, of guilt, of the God that we knew, but was being distorted by man made ideology and legalism.
And what we didn't expect was you.
I didn't expect this community.
I didn't expect to be seen, known and challenged. I didn't expect the healing that would come from simply telling the truth and listening to others tell their story.
Y', all, this has been more than a podcast. This has been a sanctuary, a fight club at times, but always a family.
And as I sit here recording the final episode of the Recovering Fundamentalist podcast, I want to thank God for giving us this platform. I want you to know that this is not goodbye.
This is a thank you.
Thank you for showing up.
Thank you for walking with me.
Thank you for trusting me with your stories.
Thank you for letting us be a part of your story.
I don't know what the podcast meant to you, but I can tell you what it meant to me. You've helped me remember why I love Jesus. You've helped me remember why community is so important.
You reminded me that truth doesn't have to come with shame, that grace is still good news, that freedom is possible, and that we are never really as alone as we think we are. Oh, a new season is coming, a new podcast, new voices. But the mission remains the same, to walk in truth, to live in freedom and to follow Jesus with everything we got, y', all, the story is not over. The best is yet to come.
You know, for 200 episodes, the two words let's go to maybe some, it sounded like a catchphrase, but to me, it's always been a declaration.
Let's go is a push.
Let's go is a challenge. Let's go is a reminder that no matter what you've walked through, no matter how heavy the past has been, no matter how long you've sat in the rubble of religion, hurt or confusion, you don't have to stay there.
Let's go has always meant don't settle, don't stop, don't look back. It's time to move forward in freedom, in healing, in truth and in grace.
So with one final time, not as a sign off, but as a charge to keep going, let's go.
I love you. And I love you, kids, forever and ever and always.
