Episode Transcript
[00:00:09] Speaker A: Now, listen closely, Donald J. Trump, the president of the United States, will 100%.
[00:00:16] Speaker B: Remain the president of the United States.
[00:00:18] Speaker A: For another term, ladies and gentlemen.
[00:00:20] Speaker B: He has single handedly won the greatest.
[00:00:23] Speaker A: Landslide victory in the history of this nation. Everybody, thanks for tuning in to the recovering fundamentalist podcast, where your host, Matt Dudley. Nathan Cravat. I'm JC Groves. Good to have you here on episode 180, boys. We are almost to 200 episodes. Only took us about five years to get there, but we're almost there.
[00:00:44] Speaker C: We would have been there a long time ago if we hadn't switched to once a month, but it's true. And remember, you had it mapped out. You knew what date we were going to hit it.
[00:00:51] Speaker A: I was so ready. But this is August episode. It's still August. It's the 28th, so we're going to get this in in August.
Well, be honest.
[00:01:02] Speaker B: The first 177 episodes went a lot faster for me.
[00:01:07] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:01:09] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:01:10] Speaker A: How you been, Dudley?
[00:01:11] Speaker B: Great, bro.
[00:01:12] Speaker A: How you been going on?
[00:01:14] Speaker B: You know what? We're. We're starting a big building project. Well, they're already doing it, as you could hear the big machines moving in the background a few minutes ago.
Had to suspend construction so we could record, but anyway, we're putting in a 150 seat balcony that begins in two weeks and just got sprinkler systems going in, but, yeah. And then we've got our big, big annual outdoor event we call ridge stock on September 8.
[00:01:44] Speaker A: That looks cool.
[00:01:45] Speaker B: Yeah, it's a lot of fun. So. But it's also a lot of work behind the scenes leading up to it. But it's gonna be good, man. So I'll be.
I'll be sharing my testimony that weekend, which is always tough. And it's easier to preach a sermon, for me, at least, but be sharing my testimony in the town that I grew up in, so I can't embellish any of my stories.
[00:02:08] Speaker A: They know.
[00:02:09] Speaker B: Yeah, they know.
[00:02:10] Speaker A: Do y'all do that at the fairground?
[00:02:12] Speaker B: Yeah, we rent the fairgrounds out. Yeah, we have it rented for two weekends this year because of the construction, so we have to be out of the building for two Sundays. So we just.
We coordinated the construction project with rich stock. So September eighths, rich stock. And the next Sunday is just regular service at the fairgrounds. But that weekend, we're doing a youth emphasis. So have some special things going on then, as well.
[00:02:36] Speaker C: Nice.
[00:02:37] Speaker A: Awesome.
[00:02:37] Speaker B: Yeah, it'd be good.
[00:02:39] Speaker A: Rest it up from all your camps.
[00:02:41] Speaker B: Shoot. No, not quite. Not quite.
[00:02:45] Speaker A: Well, Corvette, how's life in Asheville, man?
[00:02:49] Speaker C: Life has been busy in Asheville. As you know, we had the men of valor conference here in Black Mountain, just 15 minutes from my house in Asheville. And that went amazing. So many RFP fam there. A lot of guys I've met for the first time. A lot of guys I've met before and saw again. And so many deep, meaningful conversations with guys that just wanted to stop me and tell me how much the podcast meant to their life. Like it has changed lives. And specifically, they were telling me about getting involved in healthy churches, leaving a toxic church behind, trying to have conversations with pastors, like things that are very, very specific. And, man, I was just incredibly encouraged. Had an awesome conference. I love Eric and the guys over there, man. Do you know they're part of the RFP network? And if you hadn't checked out the men of Valor podcast, it's awesome. And our buddy Randall did announce, finally.
[00:03:46] Speaker A: Remove him from the group. Me.
[00:03:48] Speaker C: Well, I made a joke the first night when I was there because Randall wasn't in room. I was like, did you. Did y'all finally fire Randall? And they all kind of looked at me real funny and I was like, uh oh. And then turns out they didn't fire him. But he is stepping down. He's starting his m div. And he's got a lot of things going on with this church. He's a youth pastor, a really large church. And so, man, a lot of good things are happening there. But was sad to hear that. Randall stepping down. We love him, and we do. Like, one of the things I love about him most is how you and him go back and forth. I think if you're in the room with JC and Randall, you think they hate each other, but they're just like brothers.
[00:04:26] Speaker A: I'm just kidding. Don't. Don't say a large church. That'll make his ego much bigger than what it is already. It's a small church with a big youth group. I'll put it that way. I'm kidding. It's a good sign. But I love his excuse. His. Not his excuse, his reasoning. He is starting his MDIV, but he's also taking this time because he wants to spend more time with his family and, you know, spend time with his boys and his wife. And I always admire that. And, yeah, that's a big thing to step away from when you're on the executive committee, you step away. That's. That's a big. That's a big decision to make. So good on you. I'm so glad we don't have to put up with your junk on the group me anymore.
[00:05:03] Speaker B: So.
[00:05:05] Speaker C: That's great.
[00:05:07] Speaker A: Well, what else?
[00:05:09] Speaker C: This weekend, I'm going to Chattanooga, Tennessee, for my daughter Kate's birthday, Austin's wife. And so I'll be there for a couple days. We have tons of plans. Got a. Gotta hook up with you, JC, when I'm there.
Yeah, we've got Sunday. I've got to rush back after our plans on Saturday to be here for Sunday, which is our two year anniversary for Hope church, Asheville. Can you believe that? Two years. And we've got big plans for that, man. Matt, I've been enjoying teaching through first corinthians, bro. We're.
[00:05:42] Speaker B: We just.
[00:05:43] Speaker C: We just finished chapter four.
But, dude, I absolutely love first corinthians. And next week at our anniversary service, I'm jumping into chapter five, which is intense and very appropriate for Asheville. It's talking about sexual immorality. So.
[00:06:01] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah.
[00:06:03] Speaker C: First Corinthians is.
[00:06:04] Speaker B: I'm in chapter. I'm in week three of chapter eleven. I haven't got past verse 16 yet, but. Yeah, bro. Yeah. It covers a lot.
A lot of ground and a lot of things. Even that. That we plan to talk about a little bit today, I think.
[00:06:24] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:06:24] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:06:24] Speaker C: Definitely been.
[00:06:25] Speaker B: I've been dealing with. Yeah, yeah.
[00:06:28] Speaker C: So next week I'll be in Winter Haven, Florida, speaking at the behold our God conference. And then the next week, I'll be at Hope church, Trenton, their eight year anniversary. I'll be speaking for that. Then I've got a conference in Boston, going to Maine on a trip with my wife for the weekend. And then in October, I'm headed back to Nepal. So, JC, when I tell people I'm busy, I'm not just blowing smoke, I am bussing. Is that. Is that.
[00:06:59] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:06:59] Speaker A: Dog water, bro.
[00:07:01] Speaker B: Fire.
[00:07:02] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:07:04] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:07:07] Speaker A: That'S good. Well, we are equally busy over here.
Life has been crazy this whole summer.
[00:07:13] Speaker C: You've got a big announcement.
[00:07:15] Speaker A: Yeah, man, we're excited. We've. We've spent the entire summer, spent a lot of time at word of life in Florida. Where to life? New York. Enjoyed those weeks tremendously. I got to be on the stacking chairs podcast with our buddy Cal Gray. And that should be releasing. I think they release episodes like we do just whenever.
So that. That episode is coming out soon. But, man, we got back here and the church. We are. Our two year anniversary here is October 30, but we're not even at our two year anniversary yet. But, man, we. We've been renting out this 120 year old building. It's awesome, but we've literally outgrown it. And we were looking. We have looked at every building, every piece of property in Catoosa county. Nothing was available. So we just kind of leadership and I got together and said, hey, I think what we need to do is just pause and just plan on staying here. We'll start a third service. That literally was the last thing I wanted to do. And then three weeks ago, we get a call. There's a building that was supposed to be sold and that's why it's been off the market completely. The guy that owns it called and said, hey, this lady was going to buy it. She's backed out. It's for rent. Do you want it? And I was like, did Tim Tebow have a quiet time? Yes. Let's do this thing. And, man, in three weeks, we have gone from this 150 seat auditorium and we will be moving into our 350 seat auditorium. It's about 3000 sqft. Larger. Rents going up just a little bit, but it's going to give us just so much more room, you know, Dudley, it's kind of like the move y'all did a few years ago from a smaller building to a larger building. But there's also a lot of headaches that come with that. So we get the keys on Sunday, September 1, and we have one month to flip that building around. And we've already had people over there painting, filling holes, getting it ready. I mean, it's going to be incredible where I'm fired up. I am already exhausted for what the month of October looks like, or, excuse me, the month of September looks like, but we're going to get in there and it's. I'm fired up. It's going to be awesome. God's doing a lot of good stuff. And man, what a. What a. What a way to cap off an incredibly busy summer just by an incredibly busy fall.
Yeah, it's gonna be fun.
[00:09:29] Speaker C: I'm excited, guys. Man, that's a. That's a big answer to prayer, JC.
[00:09:33] Speaker A: Oh, it's. It's huge. It's. It's really cool to see what God's been doing here. I told everybody Sunday, I was like, you know, we're not affiliated with the denomination right now. And if we were, we just baptized our 50th person in 23 months as a church. I was like, man, we'd have a write up in the outreach magazine and a plaque on the wall if we were southern Baptist. A lot of fun there. But I just.
[00:09:55] Speaker B: Is this the. Is this the second church you've planted JC.
[00:09:58] Speaker A: Well, the first one was a campus of a multi site church.
[00:10:02] Speaker B: Right.
[00:10:02] Speaker A: We were, we were a campus. And so that was a church plant. I just didn't preach every week. I was a campus pastor. Which campus pastors at a multi site church are pretty much your middle of the road middle management. You're kind of a facilitator if you're not a preaching campus pastor. But that, that place is doing great. We're actually moving back to the same city, Ringgold, that that church is in. Yeah, they, they're in a $7 million building. And we moved in on Sunday, quit on Monday, and here we are.
[00:10:33] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:10:34] Speaker A: Good to be home. I love Ringold.
[00:10:36] Speaker B: Yeah, that's awesome. I feel like church planting gets in your blood. It's almost like an adrenaline, adrenaline rush, though.
We're almost eight years into this one, and I mean, when I tell you that, I mean, this is, it's really a dream church, the way God's just worked it out. But I'm itching to start another church. Not that I'm going anywhere, but, man, that's not an announcement that I'm leaving, but there's. But, but just hearing you talk about that, it's so exciting. I love seeing God open those doors. And I think one of the important elements of longevity in ministry, especially pastoring specifically, is that you just keep that stuff fresh, keep that excitement, and just. God's always creating and doing and moving, and it's real easy to get in a slump after six, seven, 8910 years. So thankfully, we haven't hit any of those slumps. Going into another big building project. I love it. It's going to be a headache. It's going to be a mess around here for like three to four months. Yeah, but, yeah, that's exciting. I'm excited to see what God's doing down there.
[00:11:45] Speaker A: Well, y'all can come see it because we have, for the sake of the gospel conference coming up in November, the first week of November, for the sake of the gospel conference right here. I've had some folks ask, is it canceled? Is it still happening? No, it's still happening. You're going to be in our new building. Now, we may be BYOC. Bring your own chair up to that point, but we're gonna be doing it here.
[00:12:06] Speaker B: You told me that was a byob deal.
[00:12:08] Speaker A: Well, that's later, I guess. I don't know. So it's bring. Now we'll have chairs. We've had, we've had some churches stepping up already. Patrick Everett and them down at First Baptist, Ford o donated 150 chairs. And it's gonna be awesome. So, for the sake of the gospel conference is happening on the first weekend, Friday and Saturday and Sunday of November. And, Nate, I don't know if you even know this because you were working on your Internet, but Dudley might be coming.
[00:12:38] Speaker C: Dude, that would be amazing.
[00:12:41] Speaker B: Yeah. So I'm trying to work it out.
[00:12:44] Speaker A: So we should be having the schedule coming out here in the next couple weeks, as we are now getting pretty close to that. And. Nope, no ticket to buy, no registration, lodgings on your own, foods on your own. You just get here, and we're gonna have a great time for the sake of the gospel conference, year number three, and we can't wait to see you there.
[00:13:04] Speaker C: And we've got Israel 2025 just around the corner, coming up in January.
[00:13:09] Speaker A: You think it's gonna happen?
[00:13:10] Speaker C: I do think it's gonna happen. I was with Marcus Merritt last week, and he's convinced it's happening, man. They've got groups over there now.
[00:13:17] Speaker B: It's.
[00:13:18] Speaker C: It's going on the. There's two or three hoops to jump through. One is our government obviously, can choose to shut down, travel to a certain area, then israeli government can choose to shut it down. And then the local.
What's the name of the travel agent we used?
Man, I just.
Yes, they can choose to shut down a trip on their own. So there's three levels of security clearance that basically, right now, they're all open with everything that's going on.
Everything that's been happening has been in outlying areas, mainly, and the dome is still working, even though we had some reports on Twitter a few weeks ago that the dome was no longer working. The Iron dome is working. Missiles are being blocked. So I believe it's going to happen.
[00:14:06] Speaker A: That's it.
[00:14:07] Speaker B: My buddy who lives in Israel, I messaged him a couple weeks ago and asked him how things are going, and he's like, oh, brother, it's fine. Everybody's going to the beach and vacationing. I was like, okay, yes. You know, war over there is, you know, like, second day. Yeah, right, cap, no, yeah.
[00:14:29] Speaker A: It's the cheapest you'll ever be able to go. And, Matt, you gotta turn your phone off when you record it. Podcast, man.
[00:14:35] Speaker B: I'm the new kid.
[00:14:36] Speaker A: Speaking of that, I need to mute mine because it's still on ring.
Cheapest you'll ever be able to go. It's a. It's gonna be an incredible trip. Pastor's trip. You can go to recovering fundamentalist.org click on the Israel tab and sign up to go with us. I'm excited about today's episode. We are right in the middle of a pretty heated political season in our country, and we've been.
[00:15:06] Speaker C: Deadly space when that happened.
[00:15:08] Speaker A: How do you love it?
[00:15:10] Speaker B: How do you do not disturb on your. It's coming up on my Mac.
[00:15:14] Speaker C: Yeah, I probably need to do that, too.
[00:15:16] Speaker A: I don't know either, because every time I get a text, hit things on my computer and I just roll with it.
That's funny.
I got a clue who they are.
[00:15:25] Speaker C: Hey, welcome to the live audience. It's official, guys.
[00:15:29] Speaker A: I hope.
I don't know. It's kind of scary. We can't see.
[00:15:33] Speaker C: Hey, jump in the chat and tell us who you are, please.
[00:15:37] Speaker A: At your area. I'm gonna pick. Oh, there's a chat.
[00:15:39] Speaker C: That's me.
[00:15:42] Speaker B: Where's the chat? I don't see it, but over there.
[00:15:45] Speaker C: To the right side.
[00:15:48] Speaker A: I love that we replaced one.
[00:15:53] Speaker B: I found it.
[00:15:54] Speaker C: Hey, are we gonna sing? We're gonna have the new RFP trio if Matt comes to the meetup.
[00:16:01] Speaker B: Yeah, I don't, man.
[00:16:02] Speaker C: Crowder.
[00:16:03] Speaker B: Dude, we do.
[00:16:04] Speaker C: Crowder.
[00:16:05] Speaker B: Yeah.
Brian has that. That classic. So do you, though, JC. Classic southern gospel.
[00:16:13] Speaker A: Yeah. Dude, I look like I have jaundice.
[00:16:16] Speaker B: You do.
[00:16:17] Speaker A: Very yellow. Driving me nuts.
[00:16:20] Speaker B: Oh, you're all distorted.
[00:16:21] Speaker C: Because they're professional. They're professional singers and musicians.
[00:16:26] Speaker A: Chris Williams. Hello.
[00:16:29] Speaker C: What's up, Chris?
Welcome.
[00:16:32] Speaker A: So, guys, this is episode 180, and no doubt we have been talking on our text group, and everywhere we go, everybody realizes and understands that this is a very heated political season. The RNC just had their gathering. The DNC just had their gathering every day. It doesn't matter what social media platform, you can't get on social media turn on the news without something political. It seems like everything is breaking news these days, and a lot of folks are asking, where do I stand on all this? How does a follower of the way of Jesus approach the political season? And not that any of us three have the answers to this, but I think this is a conversation that we can kind of speak into, and we're not expecting you to agree with everything that we say here. No doubt, politics is one of the biggest dividers of everybody. We're not asking you to come in and take our opinion as fact. We're just going to share with you today as we are in an election season, kind of what's on our heart as we are in this very heated political time. So, that being said, I think we need to get ready with episode number 180. Y'all ready to go?
[00:17:41] Speaker C: I'm ready.
[00:17:42] Speaker B: Let's roll.
[00:17:44] Speaker A: Let's go.
The recovering fundamentalist podcast starts in three.
[00:18:04] Speaker C: You know what makes women stupid as cops?
[00:18:06] Speaker A: Jesus was not a bartender high, man. Two.
[00:18:10] Speaker C: You have lost your mind.
[00:18:13] Speaker B: Long tongue heifers have given me a.
[00:18:15] Speaker A: Lot more trouble than heifers wearing britches. And you know that.
[00:18:18] Speaker C: Say amen right there.
[00:18:19] Speaker B: One. Let me tell you something, bozo.
[00:18:22] Speaker A: They'll be selling frosties in hell for this. Boy puts on a pair of pink underwear. Amen.
[00:18:27] Speaker B: I sucked my thumb till I was.
[00:18:29] Speaker A: 14 years of age. High back.
[00:18:32] Speaker B: Oh.
[00:18:33] Speaker A: Never gets old, boys.
[00:18:34] Speaker B: Who wears pink underwear, though?
[00:18:38] Speaker A: How does that.
[00:18:39] Speaker B: How does that randomly. How does that randomly come up in a sermon? That's oddly specific.
[00:18:47] Speaker C: Fascinating.
[00:18:47] Speaker B: That intro. That intro never does get old.
[00:18:50] Speaker C: What's that fascination with pink underwear? Of all the things you could be fascinated with, man.
[00:18:55] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, who was that?
[00:18:59] Speaker C: Jack Howells.
[00:19:00] Speaker B: No, no, not the pink underwear. That was.
[00:19:03] Speaker A: No, it was.
[00:19:04] Speaker B: No, no, it wasn't.
[00:19:06] Speaker C: No, that was sucking his thumb. That was Larry Brown.
[00:19:09] Speaker B: Larry Brown.
[00:19:10] Speaker C: Smash your tv, Larry Brown.
[00:19:12] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah.
[00:19:13] Speaker C: The feet, Larry.
[00:19:15] Speaker B: The kissing toe. Larry Brown.
[00:19:17] Speaker C: Fascinations, man. Sheesh.
[00:19:19] Speaker B: The foot fetish, pink underwear.
[00:19:21] Speaker A: No cap.
Goodness.
[00:19:25] Speaker C: Hey, JC, speaking of weird things. So this is a election year, you know, political, divisive podcast. So I figured I could start off with a joke. Brian's not here anymore for the dad jokes section, but I know you love a good dad joke, but. So. So do you know what they did before the invention of crowbars?
[00:19:49] Speaker A: No.
[00:19:50] Speaker C: Before the invention of crowbars, crows just drank at home.
[00:19:55] Speaker B: Dude. I miss Brian.
[00:20:00] Speaker C: I gotta give Logan Meyer credit for that one.
[00:20:02] Speaker A: That is on the podcast now. So that's a. Oh, yeah, you're the new pappy.
[00:20:10] Speaker C: Hey, that's a pretty good dad joke.
[00:20:12] Speaker A: Well, that was pretty funny. I love that you're cracking yourself up.
[00:20:15] Speaker B: That's what's even funnier, which. That's the classic dad joke.
[00:20:18] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly.
[00:20:19] Speaker B: He's the only one who laughs.
[00:20:20] Speaker C: You just gotta laugh at yourself.
[00:20:22] Speaker A: What I do love is your commitment to this episode and to the topic. You are decked out in red, white and blue today, man.
[00:20:30] Speaker C: See this.
[00:20:33] Speaker B: Capital.
[00:20:34] Speaker C: This shirt, man, I.
[00:20:36] Speaker B: What were you doing at the Capitol?
[00:20:39] Speaker C: I was. That was back when I was working for a travel company that took students on field trips, like, to Washington DC for a week. So got to go to Washington, DC. I actually got paid to go to Washington DC for a week. Leading like 150 students or something like that. But bought this shirt and. Hey, JC, what's more american than the Atlanta Braves?
Nothing.
[00:21:04] Speaker A: Nothing.
[00:21:05] Speaker B: St. Louis Card.
[00:21:06] Speaker C: That wasn't a dad joke. It was just. It was just.
[00:21:08] Speaker A: I forgot that Dudley is a Cardinals fan.
[00:21:12] Speaker C: Dudley.
[00:21:13] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:21:14] Speaker A: You're.
[00:21:18] Speaker B: But to be fair, I don't really get into sports a whole lot, so.
[00:21:23] Speaker A: Sports ball. Okay.
[00:21:25] Speaker B: Yeah. If I'm at a ball game, I'm the. I'm the biggest fan there. But if you ask me right now, if you ask me right now, where the Cardinals are in. Horrible.
[00:21:37] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:21:37] Speaker B: I have no idea.
[00:21:38] Speaker A: It's kind of like my wife. I don't know if I've ever told you all this.
[00:21:41] Speaker B: Did you say I'm like your wife?
[00:21:42] Speaker A: Well, in this way, you are. Just said that. The very first baseball game that I ever took Kim to. Kim grew up amish. Kim never did anything sports related. We went to an Atlanta Braves Chicago Cubs game. We're sitting behind home plate, about 15 rows back. Great seats. She did good with the seats. That was the first and only time. And Bobby Cox walks out and hands the lineup card to the umpire. And my wife, I am not joking, went, oh, Boyden, baby, look, he just gave that man the key to the city.
What? I mean, people around us were like, what did that girl just say? I was like, you gotta be kidding me, man. So that was. That was her mentality. So she's Matt Dudley in that regard.
[00:22:26] Speaker B: Okay. Yeah. That was not busing.
[00:22:29] Speaker A: No, that was cap right there. We have no idea what these words mean. We could possibly be cussing at each other. But, yeah, it's dog water. Well, speaking of dog water, let's talk about politics.
[00:22:40] Speaker B: Politics is definitely Ohio.
[00:22:43] Speaker C: Yep. Hey, Chris.
[00:22:45] Speaker A: Ohio. Riz.
[00:22:46] Speaker C: Chris, who's in our livestream, he just said, chop on. So we've got a brave fan.
[00:22:53] Speaker A: Or is he a Florida state Seminole fan?
[00:22:55] Speaker C: There you go.
[00:22:57] Speaker A: Either way, we're pretty sad after that first horrible game. But, yeah, we had a whole started on this topic of election year and not calvinist year, but we're talking about medical. Yeah.
[00:23:09] Speaker C: The doctrine of election goes all the way back to the apostle Paul.
[00:23:14] Speaker B: I'm way more interested in that.
[00:23:17] Speaker C: Okay, so before we talk about the election year and start talking about politics, we've got to set the context for this topic. And honestly, guys, we can't talk about politics without talking about the problem. We live in a broken world. This world is a mess.
Fallen creation is the stage upon which politics happens. So this country, every other government in the world, all politics happens on a very broken stage. That was destroyed basically at the fall of man. And people are broken. That includes politicians, voters, journalists, every aspect of politics, whether you're on the far right wing side or the far left wing side, two wings on the same bird. People are broken. And as christians and pastors, we have a biblical worldview.
So Christianity is a worldview that believes in God, a personal God. And our worldview is centered on the teachings of Jesus Christ and the authority of scripture that's revealed in the teachings of the Bible. This is how we define truth. It's how we interpret the world. So before we start talking about anything else, how messed up and divided politics are in America, we've got to understand that the world is broken. And we see that played out politics much the same way that we see that played out in our churches. Our churches are made up of people and people are broken. So it's going to be broken.
[00:24:55] Speaker B: Well, you, you know, you obviously see it. Everything on the micro winds up affecting the grander scheme of things. And, you know, all we have to do is look in our own communities and see the brokenness in people's lives, man. It's just, I deal with it as you guys do day in and day out.
And people are lost and empty and grasping, I think, for hope ultimately. And unfortunately, we tend to look to the government to be the answer when we all know from a biblical worldview that Christ is the only hope and the only answer.
[00:25:29] Speaker A: I mean, I think if you're looking at the worldview of things, there are so many problems. Places where just in the world that we live in as citizens here in the country, I mean, we got economic problems, we got people going to bed hungry in our cities.
You know, sexuality, it's under attack. I mean, gender is under attack. Marriages, the nuclear family is under attack.
Truth ultimately is under attack. I mean, your truth, my truth, truth is relevant. I saw a picture the other day, there's a bridge that just went up. I think it's Sweden that said, truth is flexible. You know, I mean, it's just whatever. If you say a lie long enough, it doesn't become truth. It's just being a lie said over and over again. But it feels like gaslighting in so many different ways from both sides of the aisle in certain times. I mean, our country's messed up. The world is really messed up. I mean, let's, let's hit on it. We get we racism, it's real. Oppression is real. Wokeness is real. It's causing a lot of, a lot of problems. And I think what we're finding when you get on social media, when you get on the news, instead of fixing these things because evil is prevailing, it's almost like we're pouring gas on that fire and just continuing to hit on those things and not fix them, but make them bigger issues, which just causes more stress and more pain and more suffering to everyone living in this world right now.
[00:26:57] Speaker C: Yeah, and as Americans, we're so different. I mean, we share this country, the american experiment, with atheists, secularists, post modernists, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists. Part of our commitment as a country is religious freedom. And as a Christian, I disagree with all those other worldviews, but I believe in their right to worship. I don't think they should be persecuted. I think we should be able to stand up for the truth and argue from a biblical worldview that theirs is wrong and ours is right. But we don't think that other faiths should be persecuted. But we're different, and we bring different things to the table. So an atheist is innately going to vote differently than a Christian in many areas. But beyond that, we're northerners and southerners, rednecks, yuppies, rich, poor, country folk, city folk. I mean, we're so deadly.
[00:27:54] Speaker A: Your northern rednecks there, are you in.
[00:27:57] Speaker C: The north, Dudley, what do you claim? Midwest. Yeah, Midwest, yeah, it's kind of mid and west. That's a great way to describe it.
[00:28:07] Speaker A: Very mid.
[00:28:08] Speaker C: Mid is in not that great or mid is in middle of the country.
[00:28:12] Speaker B: Middle. Mid, as in it's. I love it here, but.
[00:28:17] Speaker C: Yeah, I've been there once and I loved it, but bourbon was awesome.
[00:28:20] Speaker B: Yeah. This part of bourbon, Missouri? Yeah, yeah, we went to bourbon.
[00:28:25] Speaker A: Tweet that.
[00:28:26] Speaker B: Missouri?
[00:28:27] Speaker A: Missouri. Yeah, I think it's just. It's. It's crazy when you look at.
I don't know if it's the scars that we're carrying, physical crime, divorce, substance. You know, people have so much ptsd when it comes to politics. You don't know what is truth because there's so many things being thrown at us that instead of actually digging and discovering truth, you just accept whatever is being said as truth and you just press on and you just say, oh, that's what I'm with. You know? And it's. That's almost as scary as not digging in for what truth is, to be honest with you.
[00:29:04] Speaker B: Yeah, it's almost a lazy approach to it. You know, I've. I've thought about our past and fundamentalism, and sometimes it would. You think back and you think, man, it would almost just be easier to stay in that element without ever questioning. And, you know, just, you stay in the safety of your own little camp. And I. And I think that's what a lot of people do on the grander scale as well. When it comes to politics, they just sort of pick a lane. And it doesn't matter what the facts state or, you know, in many cases, what even science, when you talk about abortion, what the scientific community has discovered that, of course, the word of God already revealed to us. But, yeah, it's in many ways just a lack of seeking truth, which is a large scale problem.
[00:29:52] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:29:53] Speaker A: How many. I mean, you just hit the nail on the head. How many people that listen to the recovering fundamentalist podcast, they stay where they are because it is comfortable.
[00:30:03] Speaker B: Right.
[00:30:04] Speaker A: And that's. Man, that is the.
[00:30:06] Speaker B: It's the devil, you know?
[00:30:07] Speaker A: Yeah. You just do what you do because it's the way you always do it. I just vote on a party line because it's the party line I've always voted with. Instead of trying to figure out what's actually being said, what is just rhetoric that's being spewed, what, you know, and so we just, it's more comfortable to just go with the flow.
[00:30:24] Speaker C: And everything is magnified in an election year. And there's probably a couple reasons for that. Like, do you guys think that's intentional? Like, the Republicans have to get everything stirred up to create this fear, to get people to vote for Republicans, Democrats have to get all this fear stirred up. And it seems like this, it's always election year when, when a pandemic breaks out or when, you know, the world's about to melt and climate change is finally getting ready to destroy every. It's when you start hearing about everything that it seems like it's just magnified in election year. Or maybe it's just that we're thinking about these things more in an election year because it feels like we have the opportunity to change some things which we can debate about whether or not we really have, if our vote really makes a difference, if we really can change anything. I believe it does, and I vote for it, but I understand why people say, you know what, it doesn't matter.
[00:31:22] Speaker A: But see, that goes right in line with what Dudley just said. Those that say, well, my vote doesn't matter. So you just sit at home and you expect there. But then we complain we didn't vote, but yet we'll complain about all this stuff and that that's, that's what happens. Well, my vote doesn't matter anyhow. Nothing's going to change. I've heard that said so many times. Your literal only freedom, fundamental freedom that you have in this is to vote. And, you know, we're not, we're not telling you one way or the other to vote here today. We want you to do the digging in with that because I'm sure even politically, all three of us would disagree on certain areas. But you gotta, you know, and this is, this is a topic, and I know it's a little bit offbeat, but we can edit it out if we need to. I hear people get online and I see people that I respect on X or Twitter who are adamant about not voting for Trump because they don't like who he is as a person, does who he is as a person. Trump, for, no pun intended, his policies and who he is and who we're voting for and vice versa. She's a woman. Kamala is a woman. You know, she, she has these policies. We're not voting for a pastor. I've heard this argument. We're not voting for a pastor or voting for a commander in chief. Where do y'all find yourself in that argument? Right there.
[00:32:42] Speaker B: I mean, I think the person's character has to be brought into the arena of conversation.
[00:32:47] Speaker A: Voting for nobody.
[00:32:49] Speaker B: I, well, and that's, but, but also, and not to sound like the textbook conspiracy theorists, but I think they let us see what, what they think we want to see about when it comes to their character. So at the end of the day, it's, it's almost like, well, we were talking about being in first corinthians. I'm about to start chapter twelve in a couple of weeks, and I'll be dealing with spiritual gifts. On the subject of discernment, one of the things that I teach on that topic is that discernment has to be tested with truth. And so as that pertains to a person, as you mentioned, policies and those types of things, at the end of the day, of course, it's like, okay, I don't know if either one of these candidates are actually good people behind closed doors. Like, I don't know if they have good character. I don't know who they are in their private lives. But all I can really judge is which policies they stand behind, how they have voted historically, and where they stand on the issues. So I get that. I get that part about a person's personal life and all those things. But at the end of the day, we're still, as we already mentioned, everybody's broken from the president to the pauper.
You just have to look at the black and white issues, in my opinion.
[00:34:07] Speaker C: Yeah, I agree. Yeah. And as I think about it, man, I go deep in this every year, and I study, and I want to know what. What the best vote is. I wish there were some different options.
I wish Mike Huckabee was running. That's just me personally, but he's.
[00:34:29] Speaker A: That's funny you said that. Do you remember years ago when he came to Chattanooga, me and you were on the front row?
[00:34:35] Speaker C: Yep. We were there.
[00:34:36] Speaker A: And he palmed my head. We got a picture. You took the picture. It literally popped up on my timeline. Mike Huckabee's palming my head. And I'm going, yeah.
[00:34:45] Speaker C: And me and my son ended up. Me and Austin ended up on the COVID of UF, USA Today on their website. And, man, he was just like, ten back then. But that's how we. You know, I. I wish we did have some people that maybe weren't pastors, but maybe could be qualified in a few points as a pastor. But, um, as. As we look at what we've got, what we have in this country, man, I.
I'm as frustrated as everybody else is, but we've got to operate within the system that we have. Daniel. You're going through the book of Daniel. JC, he. He was in Babylon, and he had to support some policies and things that he didn't understand or didn't agree with, but it was his job. And he stood against certain policies that almost cost him his own life because he refused to pray to a false deity and things like that. So we've got to understand the context of where we're at. And I agree with what both of you guys are saying, man, it's. It's complicated. But here's the thing we have to acknowledge. Christians have to live according to their conscience. Now, our conscience should be informed by scripture. I know people that are bound to their conscience about things that the Bible doesn't say based on what their pastor has said or someone has taught the Bible out of context. But we. We are commanded to only act out of faith. And if I can't do something out of faith, I understand people that are saying they can't vote for Trump. Trump. I hear that. And I disagree, because I think we only have two options. I think solid christians can vote for Trump.
I do know we're called to be faithful to our conscience, but our conscience should be informed by scripture.
[00:36:34] Speaker B: Right?
[00:36:35] Speaker A: It's true.
[00:36:36] Speaker B: You know what I hate about it? All of it. Is how divisive the whole thing is.
[00:36:42] Speaker C: Yeah, that's it.
[00:36:46] Speaker B: Just this idea. And of course, this bleeds into our churches. I'm seeing that every, every time there's an election year, I see the polarization of people. Even like you said, we, the three of us, may possibly disagree on some probably more nuanced political topics. I would imagine the fundamental issues, I'm sure we're 100% probably on the same page. But, you know, it's just this. It's a divide and conquer mindset. And not that we're here to talk about spiritual warfare, but I think you have to bring that into the equation from a christian point of view, is the ultimate goal is to steal, kill and destroy.
And the means through which that's carried out is by dividing God's people and keeping us from having conversations. Everybody's a keyboard warrior. Everybody wants to go on these disparaging character attacks when the reality is, I mean, I've recently, and I mean, I could say some things that would be controversial, that would probably. That brings some controversy in my life. Just people that I've sat and had conversations with recently that I would fundamentally disagree with on some high levels. But I've been able to sit and say, you know, hey, from a biblical worldview, you know, here's what I believe, and this is where I stand, and this is my, you know, this is my north for all things pertaining to truth. But I've had good conversations with people who would be, on many levels, a thousand miles from where I am.
And I just think those things are important. We have to realize that we all ultimately have the same goals, which is to live in freedom. We want to live peaceful lives. We want to be able to live prosperous lives here in America. We want to be able to help people in other countries who are not as fortunate as we are. I mean, ultimately, we all have the same goals. It's the means to get to that end that we disagree upon, but we have to keep in mind the things that do unite us.
[00:38:40] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:38:41] Speaker C: Yeah. Our country is divided in every, every way, and that's something that all parties agree on and even people in the middle. Our country is divided politically, spiritually, culturally, economically, philosophically, every way possible. We are divided. And that goes back to what we talked about earlier. We're so different. We're from the country. We're from the city. We're rich, we're poor. We're, you know, I'm a third generation immigrant. My grandparents moved over here from Spain and Italy, and they met in California and got married. We're all different, but that doesn't mean we have to be divided, right?
Matt and I are both going through the book of First Corinthians and it's about division. The Church of Corinth is divided. Why? Mainly because they're embracing worldly wisdom rather than godly wisdom. And the results of that are that they're fighting over their leaders. This is where the whole Paul Apollos Cephas argument comes in. And Paul handles that firmly. He's not going to allow them to make him an idol and he's not going to compete with these other men. But that comes from believing like the world beliefs. And it resulted in sexual sin, it resulted in pride. And he ultimately said they were attacking the temple of God. So they were, they were divided in the church. And man, we could spend the rest of this podcast talking about how divided the church is, and why would we expect the world to not be divided when we can't even figure it out inside of the church, the church, I mean, and that goes all the way back to when the apostle Paul was the pastor of the church. That makes me feel a little bit better.
[00:40:26] Speaker B: Right. Well, that's as I said, we're in chapter eleven, which is about distinct roles between men and women. It's about. It's about leadership. Paul says, follow me as I also follow Christ, or imitate me as I imitate Christ. And I put a diagram up on the screen this past Sunday. It was just a circle with society, individuals, family and church. And I said, what we've done is we've allowed society to affect us as individuals. As individuals we have affected change in our families and families affect the church, when in reality we as individuals should be changed by the gospel and operating in the spirit of the gospel, which should affect the way we love each other within the four walls of the church, which should affect the way that we affect, you know, that we should be changing society rather than society changing us. And I mean, that is the essence of worldliness, again, to use what some would call a trigger word from our background, but it really is the thing that keeps us chasing our tails and being ineffective is we've allowed that element of worldliness. It's not dress and it's not not having tattoos or those things. That's not the essence of worldliness. Worldliness is having a worldly attitude, and a worldly attitude is a divisive attitude.
And what separates us is the love of Jesus Christ. That's what distinguishes us and the love of Christ dictates to me that I have to, number one, admit that I don't have all the answers.
And number two, humble myself, and number three, be willing to sit and converse with people who have different views than I have. And that doesn't mean they're going to change my views. It does mean, however, I can show them kindness and compassion and generosity in spite of our differences.
[00:42:14] Speaker A: And I think what you're hitting on, I mean, it's very true that the outside political temperature is coming into the church. And, yeah, you know, we would be fools to think that everybody in our churches on Sunday line up exactly where we are politically, you know, but, but there is a way to have right conversations, healthy conversations, and there's still family and still press forward. I mean, you know, listen, there's people in your own family that you don't like, but you won't go on vacation with them, but you'll cry at their funeral. Right.
[00:42:47] Speaker B: Right.
[00:42:47] Speaker A: I mean, we all have those people that we, we, we love, but we don't necessarily like, we don't always have to agree. I think that's where growing up, the culture that we did, we felt this pressure to agree 100% with everybody. And if you disagreed any, you were outcasted, right? Yeah. Let me give you an example. I mean, just in my church, we're a brand new church plant. We're growing still. We're still learning. I don't preach on politics. It's just not something that I will stand up and, and do because I know the division that it causes, especially in a young church. Maybe if we were older, there would be that lean, but I believe the gospel is what can give us the pathway forward. And so I lean on the gospel. But I posted a picture right after Trump was shot in the ear and just said, our world is messed up. It has been getting worse and it is getting worse. And then I had the picture of Trump with his hand in the air. I didn't take anything about Trump, didn't say anything about voting for him or not. Well, that, that picture created some big emotions in some of the folks that we have here, which led to a message that was really, really rough. I mean, it's not necessarily something you want to be getting at 10:00 at night. And I was like, okay, I don't, I don't know if you're seeing what I'm saying. There is such a confusion that is placed when it comes to politics. And what is God not the author of confusion? And so this tells me that, you know, we get so red hot. And we don't think clearly. And what I discovered through this is, after some time to breathe, came back to it. You know, there was apologies there for. For saying the things that they did. They're back at the church. We're growing through this. And I reassured her, hey, listen, my hope is not in an elected official. It's not in who's in Washington. My hope is found in Jesus. We can disagree on policies, we can disagree on politics and candidates and things like that if you want.
But what we have to understand at the end of the day, as followers of the way our hope is in Jesus, our hope is in who was on the throne and God is on the throne. And that ultimately, that doesn't mean we sit on our hands and we just don't talk about this stuff or. Or think about it. But we have to press forward and look through the lens of scripture. Look through the lens of Jesus is alive, he's on the throne. And allow that to be the guide, if you will, for our conversations, because, man, they can go south in a hurry if we're talking in our own self. You know what I mean?
[00:45:28] Speaker B: Right?
[00:45:29] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:45:30] Speaker B: You know, and I think that we. I've been. I've been to, for several months, dug in deep into the subject of eschatology, and not that we're going down that road today, but I would love to be a post millennialist.
It's the most optimistic view of future things. I don't see it biblically, but one of the problems I see with post mill is they kind of adopt some of them, a lot of them, but they adopt this mindset of changing things from the top down that we got to. We need to get christians in office, which I don't disagree with that. I think you kind of alluded to that. JC.
I would love to see that. Love to see more christians getting involved. But if you take the parable of the leaven and other parables that Jesus taught about the kingdom, if post millennialism were to be biblically valid, it's not going to necessarily start from the top. It has to start at the ground level. And that's why I said, we see it in our own communities. Like, we have to be as churches. We've got to stop bickering among ourselves and dividing over stupid issues. Because what does that do? It renders the gospel ineffective. It makes Christianity look like a laughing stock when we argue over Bible versions and divide over subjects like eschatology. Eschatology is a secondary issue, but I've seen that talking about stuff right here at home. I've had people that transplanted to our church from other churches that have taken issue with me because I won't get up and, and preach certain things that they think I should preach about last days. And, like, even this war in Israel, this war, I had somebody tell me, this war in Israel, boy, I mean, this is the one. You know, this is it. I'm like, oh, it could be.
I don't, you know, I don't. But I don't have any, I don't have any biblical foundation to say dogmatically that it is so, which to me, that leads to a question I was going to ask Shane this when we had Shane Pruitt on last time, but since we're on the topic, where do we draw the line with politics? All three of us are pastors.
My opinion, and this might just be the answer, but my opinion is a moral issue, is not a political issue, even if it gets thrown into the political limelight. But again, even with that, I mean, where do we, where do we draw the line and where do we speak up versus, you know, where do we choose to just remain, maybe not silent in our private lives, but in our pulpit ministries?
[00:48:10] Speaker A: I mean, I think if it's going against the Bible, right, I will speak up. I'm not going to allow sin to just run rampant. I'm pro life, unapologetically. You know, I believe in the nuclear family.
I believe those things are things. And yes, those are very politicized policies. But if you preach the gospel, you preach the word, you will answer the questions to those things that have become political, in my opinion. Yeah, I may not say them verbatim, but I'm preaching on them.
[00:48:43] Speaker C: Yeah, we're faced with this, this year more than we've ever been faced with it before, because in the past, I think it could have legitimately been said that if you want to vote pro life, you have to vote republican. Well, this year, I don't know how much you've been paying attention, but Trump and the Republican Party are going soft on abortion because they see it's costing them votes and cost them the election last time. And so they're going soft. And, man, I'm not happy about that. I'm upset about that because I think we need to be stronger on abortion. But they're going soft on abortion. And Christians are speaking out against that, and they should be because that's a real issue.
But what is the alternative? We live in a country where there's only two potential winners of the election, that's the democratic nominee and the republican nominee. That's the only two options that we have. And the other side, Harris is 100% devoted to abortion in any way at any time.
No restrictions to birth, completely devoted to transgendered policies that are against the nuclear family, LGBTQ. All this stuff that is so far left that, yeah, the Republicans platform is getting a little bit softer, and I don't think it should be, but it's still years and years from ever getting anywhere close to how liberal the Democrats are. So we have to look at these things, man. And, Matt, it matters to me. Abortion matters to me. Marriage, the sanctity of life, sanctity of marriage, those things matter to me deeply.
I don't think. I don't think we have a Christian running for office between Trump or Kamala Harris. I don't think either one of them are true biblical, born again Christians. I think one side is going to be a lot more friendly towards Christians and towards the worldview that I possess. But, man, it's not. It's not easy to define, but we have to stand up on those issues, Matt. And.
[00:51:05] Speaker B: And I agree with you 100%, but just to. I don't know if we'd call this play in the devil's advocate, but do you feel like the way that the church at large, namely american evangelicalism, more specifically american fundamentalism and such, like, just the way that we have handled some topics? Just the.
I've kind of been on this thing, you know, as I said in one corinthians eleven, it deals with gender roles and the fact that we should be. One of my main points within this little mini series is that we should be celebrating the distinctions between men and women, not trying to blur the lines.
But I also said, I think we as christians all understand that. I mean, that's. Paul even said, it's nature, right? Like, this is nature.
This is not deep theology. This is not some kind of groundbreaking sociology. You know, we understand the basic rules between men and women. But I feel like it's. I feel like, as a pastor, I feel more compelled to preach to my church how we deal with people like that. And what I'm getting at is, again, I'm ashamed of some things I would have said back in the old days, and I'm thankful that I don't have too much material out there on YouTube from my IFB days. Now, if you dug up some old dvd's, you might find some crazy stuff, I said. But, you know, I used to. But I used. I think we have. This is kind of what I was getting at earlier about just the worldly attitude. I think that instead of following the recipe that Jesus laid out, love, bless your enemies, pray for them, love them.
I think we have adopted this mindset. If we can just hate them harder, if I can be more vitriolic and more hateful in the way that I respond to their nonsense. I mean, take the, you know, the stuff at the Olympics, again, it grossed me out. I mean, I thought it was just whatever, however you want to. However they want to explain what that was. It was weird.
You know what I mean?
It just was weird. I don't care how they can twist it, but at the same time, I just. I don't.
[00:53:26] Speaker A: I.
[00:53:26] Speaker B: But I didn't get up on Sunday and scream and holler about it as if I'm some kind of freaked out about the world acting like that. You know? I'm not surprised by that type of behavior. What surprises me is how christians respond to that kind of behavior and continue in many ways to create barricades for the gospel. Because, again, the gospel is the answer. Not to beat that drum to death, but Jesus Christ is the only one who can change a heart.
[00:53:55] Speaker A: I believe you're right, Dudley. In fact, here are a few examples.
We interrupt our program to bring you this important message.
I don't care what you think about fraudulent, sleepy Joe. He's a sex trafficking, demon possessed mongrel. He's of the left. He ain't no better than the pope. He's going to expose all these bunch of pedophiles.
I'm telling you, he's going to expose Kamala Harris for the jezebel demon that she is. Whatever you want.
[00:54:26] Speaker C: Well, let me call you a big.
[00:54:27] Speaker A: Fat, steamy piece of crap.
[00:54:29] Speaker C: Cause that's what you are. You're a big pile of ugly, disgusting crap.
[00:54:34] Speaker A: And you say, oh, I've never come back to faithful word anymore. Pastor Harrison hurt my eardrums with the word crap. You know what? This crap is being shoved down our throat every day.
[00:54:45] Speaker C: Huh?
[00:54:46] Speaker A: Does that offend you?
[00:54:50] Speaker C: Well, I'm never going back to the converse store.
You know what? If you're never going to come back.
[00:54:56] Speaker A: To faithful word Baptist church because Pastor.
[00:54:58] Speaker C: Anderson offended you and said that some transvestite's a big steaming pile of crap.
[00:55:02] Speaker A: Done. I don't want you here.
[00:55:07] Speaker C: Let me tell you something. This world is literally going insane.
They're nuts, okay? They're little pronouns.
[00:55:15] Speaker A: He, she, it, he, she, it, they.
[00:55:19] Speaker C: They forgot it, right? She, it, they. All right there. Let me say that a little faster for you. Cause that's what it is. And let me tell you something, my friend.
[00:55:29] Speaker A: This world is on a bobsled to hell, but what America needs is some old fashioned let it rip leather lung veins bulging, eyes bugging out sweat. Spittin old fashioned scriptural preaching. That's what we need. Well, is he going to talk about expositional or exegetical or topical or tropical type sermons?
I don't care if it's expositional or exegetical or esogetical or topical or tropical. As long as it's Bible. I'm for it.
What a word is this? Speaking of Jesus for with authority. That's what we're missing in the pulpits today for with authority and power. He commanded the unclean spirits and they come out. Let me tell you why people don't like authoritative preacher. Because they're preaching. Because they're devil possessed people who sit there.
[00:56:34] Speaker B: When they get that authority.
[00:56:35] Speaker A: You got devils in you, honey.
[00:56:37] Speaker C: You know why people don't like Donald Trump?
[00:56:39] Speaker B: And they love Joe Biden?
[00:56:40] Speaker A: Because Trump got authority.
[00:56:43] Speaker D: Have authority.
[00:56:44] Speaker B: Amen.
[00:56:44] Speaker A: We don't want leadership that's falling asleep while they're talking to someone else. You ever listen to me? I want somebody who has, who has a brain, who has muscles, who have authority, who can get up and lead our country, lead our churches. Men, turn up your lines and lead your family.
I'm tired of a bunch of snowflake generation coming up with no authority. Don't want to offend anybody. If you don't want to be offended, you're in the wrong church.
That's why the Lord allowed this last election to be stolen, to put us back on our knees and not to be floating along.
[00:57:24] Speaker D: What would have happened if President Trump.
[00:57:26] Speaker A: Had gotten back in?
We would have done the same thing in this midterm election in 2022 as we did in 2018. We would have gone back to sleep. I'm happy to announce that I decided to run for the president of the United States. Also be introducing the new party, the Independent Fundamental Baptist Party. If I'm elected, I will replace the constitution with the King James Bible. Every woman pastor is a false prophet in the same way every woman political leader is a scumbag such as Nancy Pelosi and Hillary Clinton.
[00:58:04] Speaker C: We need to restore toxic masculinity.
[00:58:08] Speaker A: I will put every abortion doctor and those people who commit abortion to death after a proper trial. In fact, I will even put those LGBT HIV people in a concentration camp and exterminate them. The president. I will put Donald Trump to death. I will also put Joe Biden to death. He has four children from two marriages. He is an adulterer. He has also committed other crimes that are worthy of death. Please stand by for further details.
[00:58:39] Speaker C: We return you now to your regularly scheduled program. What you're saying is exactly right, and the church doesn't always get it right because the church is made up of people. But I believe the answer is given to us in Genesis, chapter one. Genesis one tells us that we are all created in the image of God. Every man, woman, child, every nationality, ethnicity that's ever been born is made in the image of God. And if that's where I start with people, like, I don't walk up to people and, and look them up and down and look for things that I don't like and then talk about that. Some people do. I think that's some people's approach, some pastors approach. I walk up to people and look for things that we have in common. One huge thing that we all have in common is we are all made in God's image and man. I've had to live that out here in Asheville more than I've ever had to live it out in my life, man, because I'll have a woman that's dressed like a man, or maybe it's a man that's dressing like a woman who's dressed like a man. I don't know, will walk up to you with pink hair and, you know, just all sorts of.
Just every sort of crazy look you can imagine that will walk up to me waving some sort of pride flag or something like that. And if I look at that and think about all the things that I disagree with them on, how am I ever going to have a conversation with them that maybe I can win them over with the gospel? So my step one is always, they are made in God's image. And that makes me pause and reflect on the fact that that means they deserve respect, they deserve dignity, they deserve me treating them like a human being. Now, that doesn't mean I'm not going to address the other issues that we disagree about. That doesn't mean I'm not going to talk about the gospel. It just means that I want to start on a ground where we have something in common. And, you know, there's a lot of other things we have in common from the state we live in sports teams. You can find common ground with people in order to be able to address the deeper issues. And these, these guys that are out there holding signs that say God hates gay people. Or even worse than that, Westboro. Or, you know, every single sermon is them getting up and yelling and screaming about those homosexuals or screaming about democrats. I've literally heard. And we've seen some preachers preaching about demoncrats, and, you know, just, man, that's. That's not where we start with people. We've got to start with. They're made in the image of God. And I also need to learn how to deal with my brokenness.
[01:01:18] Speaker B: Right.
[01:01:18] Speaker C: And.
[01:01:19] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. Yeah.
[01:01:20] Speaker C: If I'm focused on my brokenness, I can be easier on other people and their brokenness.
[01:01:24] Speaker B: Right. And I think it's. I mean, I'm not saying it's the extent of. Of what's going on in their heads, but I. I believe they're. They expect a visceral reaction from us. They expect us to, you know, and, I mean, I've admitted this in front of my church. I mean, again, I. Pastoring in your hometown, you can't really be anything but who you are. And, I mean, I've. I've admitted that. I mean, I was raised very racist my hometown, man, when I was a kid, the Klan was very prominent. I could tell you crazy stories.
I was raised to be very racist, very bigoted, and that bled into my ministry when I. And again, I've shared my testimony on here, at least in part. But when I found out that I could preach angrier, I got the quote unquote better. I preached. And it just fits so well into my. My carnal nature. It's not natural for me, man, really. It's not natural for me to overlook things like that, that personally, beyond even any biblical conviction, things that personally just. Just disgust me and gross me out. I've got to look beyond my own prejudices, and, as you're saying, realize that they are made in the image of God. And the old saying, you've never looked into the eyes of a human being that Jesus doesn't love, and we have to learn to love them in spite of that. But like I said, I think they expect us to come back, and I feel like that feeds them.
My experience has been people like that, whatever, on the radical side, the lgbtq t community, they're used to christians acting that way. They're used to us holding signs. God hates, you know, homosexuals and those types of things. They. And I think that feeds them because the world understands hate. The world understands division.
They don't understand someone who can look them in the eye with compassion even though we disagree.
[01:03:35] Speaker C: Yeah.
Yeah.
[01:03:37] Speaker B: So I think we have, and again, using we loosely and we very specifically in some cases in my own life, I think we have fed into the divisiveness and the pushing them away ultimately from Christ, because it's Christ that will change their hearts. And that's my job. And I think that's why Paul said in Corinth, I determined not to know anything among you but Jesus Christ and him crucified. That's not all Paul stood for. That's not all Paul believed.
We get the vast majority of our church doctrine from the apostle Paul.
But he said, until you guys understand that this is our foundation, and everything that we do, teach and preach has to be in the same spirit of the grace of God that's been poured out in Christ, in the gospel. Until we can say the other things, the hard things, and have those hard conversations with that, with the attitude of mercy that Christ has given to us, then that should be all we know. Stay focused on the gospel until you can do everything and say everything else in the spirit of the gospel.
[01:04:41] Speaker C: Man, that's good, which is the heart of everything we're about here. And as you know, the first half of the book of first Corinthians is dealing with problems and solutions and the problems that they had in that church. I mean, innumerable problems. There was all sorts of problems. But it's funny, Paul only gives one solution.
His one solution is the gospel. The gospel is the answer to everything that we struggle with, everything that this world struggles with. And we've, we've gone through the gospel and explained the gospel in detail, and we'll do that again on here. But the gospel has implications for all of our lives. Sure, we're called as christians to be holy, to live righteously, godly in this present world, to deny ungodliness and worldly lust, to flee the lust of the flesh. And the gospel ultimately brings unity because it unifies us under God's truth. And here's what we need to understand. There's no true unity outside of the gospel.
[01:05:46] Speaker B: Right?
[01:05:47] Speaker C: There's just not. Now, you can have unity around atheism or islam. They unify in a certain sense, or sports or other things. You can unify. But the only way for our world to be at peace is through the prince of peace is when Jesus unites us under his truth. Because our belief drives our behavior. Our behavior always flows from our beliefs. So if we have different beliefs, then we're going to have different behaviors and we're going to be divided. So ultimately, Paul constantly drives us back in one corinthians and in his other books to the gospel. This is what. And the only thing that can change us.
[01:06:28] Speaker B: Yeah. And even, you know, I mentioned earlier the conflict in Israel where the Bible tells us to pray for the peace of Jerusalem. Jesus is the peace of Jerusalem. And there will be no peace there, here or anywhere else until Jesus becomes the center point of all that we do. And so when we pray for peace for the israeli people whom I love dearly, I have a burden for the nation of Israel and the people of Israel.
But their peace isn't going to come through a third temple or a red heifer. Their piece is going to be when they. When their eyes are open and they see Christ as their. Their slain lamb who shed his blood for their sins.
He's the. He is the peace that the world is seeking. And it's our job. And it's a. It's a. It's a heavy weight of responsibility to understand that. It's. That it's our job and not trying to overemphasize my importance or our importance, but at the same time, it is the gospel, and that's our job, to preach the gospel that changes people's world.
[01:07:36] Speaker A: We're called to live like Jesus, to be in the world, to not be of it.
[01:07:40] Speaker B: Right?
[01:07:40] Speaker A: And I believe that that's how we have to live in this time, where there's a lot of division, a lot of things that seek to divide us. We followers of the way need to stand tall more now than ever. And you know, I heard a sermon years ago, standing tall in a world full of giants. And that's really what it feels like. Like the world has so many giants, and we are called to stand tall. There's a great resource out, guys, right now that I really feel goes hand in hand with this conversation that we're having today. One of our good friends of the podcast, Greg Steer, just wrote a book. In fact, it just came out this past week. It's called radical like Jesus. And this book is a great tool to not just read, but it gives you daily steps that you can take to be radical like Jesus. And I think the best way that we as followers of the way, as we talk about politics, as we look ahead, even to an election, to how to live through this crazy time that we're living in, in our world, it's not going to get any better.
We're continuing to press forward, but we can become more like Jesus every day. And in fact, this past week, I was able to jump on a Zoom call with Greg. He was out walking in the beautiful Colorado air and just talked a little bit about his book that just came out. I want you to check out this interview with Greg Steer talking about his book, radical like Jesus. Check this out.
Well, hey there, recovering fundamentalist podcast family JC here with my buddy Greg Steer, who is out in the tundra in Colorado. And Greg, we're excited. Look at there. You'll probably see some deer here in a minute. Greg, I'm excited to have you on today. Excited about your new book. I started reading this on the plane after we met there in Florida when I was on my way up to Spoon Lake, New York. And man, I'm so excited for folks to get their hand on radical like Jesus. That comes out August 20. Tell us a little bit about your new book, Buddha.
[01:09:40] Speaker D: Well, you know, I mean, I mean, we all love Jesus, right? And we want to be radical like him. You read the gospels and you're like, is that possible?
And, you know, first John two six says, if we claim to live in it and we must walk like Jesus walked, we must live like Jesus lived. And first you're like, how do I do that? He's the son of goddess. Jesus Christ was fully God and fully human and lived in full dependence on God. He didn't cheat by using his God card. He lived independence on the Holy Spirit. And so when we live independence on the Holy Spirit, we can be radical like Jesus. One, one things, one of the things I want you to know, JC, I didn't call it radicals for Jesus. We don't need any radicals for Jesus. We need radicals like Jesus. And so it's really snaps, 21 snapshots of the life of Christ from the time he was twelve to the time he sent his disciples out to go and make disciples of all nations. And with every chapter, there's a theological insight about the life of Christ, and there's a radical like Jesus challenge at the end of the chapter. And you do that challenge before you go to the next chapter. So it's really not just about being hearers of the word, but being doers of the word. You know, I think a lot of times we as christians are really good at exegesis, but not execution. And so this is a book you can do churches across the nation this next year, and we have some of those churches doing the challenges church wide. And the reason I'm kind of walking, I'm actually in the Rocky Mountain national park right now. I mean, I'm in Esther's park at the base of the Rocky Mountain national Park. And when I wrote the, the forward for this book, I said, you know, jesus prayed all night on the mountain. I never prayed all night in the mountain. So I, I walked 3 miles into the Rocky Mountain National park with bear spray and a flashlight and my laptop, and that's awesome. And I wrote my forward. Yeah, I prayed all night.
You know, I wanted to be, hey, let's do some radical like Jesus. I want to get eaten by a bear. So I took that bear's fray, and there was something out there, too. I kept scanning the park, and above the two foot grass, I saw the, the glowing eyes about 100 yards away. I'm like, oh, lord, here we go.
But about to meet Jesus. About to meet Jesus. That's right. So anyway, so that's, that's what radical like Jesus is all about. Let's be radicals like Jesus and let's change our culture with the power of the gospel.
[01:12:23] Speaker A: Well, I shared the book with my small group leader and Jeremy Parker, and he said, man, why don't we walk through this? So my small group is getting ready to walk through the radical like Jesus. Since I was blessed to get an early copy, we're going to start it before anybody else. I'm fired up to do it, man.
[01:12:40] Speaker C: That's awesome, man.
[01:12:41] Speaker D: Well, listen, we serve it out. Look at that, look at that. Beautiful.
We serve an awesome God who spoke all this into existence, and we need to reflect the glory of Christ in and through our lives. And I know you know this, man. I, you know, I came from that fundamentalist background. I was beat up by legalism, but, you know, I'm no longer a recovering fundamentalist, and neither are you. We've been recovered by the grace of God. And now, now we are out preaching the gospel, living the gospel. During that same good news of the gospel of Christ, everyone around us and, man, hold on. Stay tuned, stay tuned. Here we go. Here we go.
There's your elk. You see the elk?
[01:13:28] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, there it is, right there.
[01:13:30] Speaker D: Right behind the golfers. Right behind some golfers. But yeah, anyway, yeah. Be praying it releases on August 20, which is my birthday. That's awesome. And Louie Giglio wrote the forward. I love Louie.
[01:13:44] Speaker B: That's awesome.
[01:13:45] Speaker D: I think you'll think you'll enjoy the book.
[01:13:47] Speaker A: That's good. They can get it anywhere. Books are sold.
[01:13:50] Speaker D: Yeah, Amazon, Barnes, nobles breaks, the, all that stuff.
[01:13:56] Speaker A: There's also a, you version devotional. Right? Did I see that? Seven days.
[01:14:00] Speaker D: Yeah, we do. We have a seven day devo that you can go to right now it kind of just, you know, get you going for living radical like Jesus because it's not just about 21 chapters and done, man. Every time we read the Bible, we should say, lord, help me be like Jesus today through the power of the Holy Spirit who dwells inside of us.
[01:14:21] Speaker A: Amen. Radical like Jesus. Go get it. Greg, good to see you. Enjoy the rest of your walk and don't get kicked by any elk out there on the, on the trailhead.
[01:14:31] Speaker D: I won't. See you, brother.
[01:14:33] Speaker A: All right, bye now.
[01:14:35] Speaker B: JC, I literally just ordered his new book on Amazon, so I'm excited to get that and have a chance to read it. Yep.
[01:14:44] Speaker A: Be sure to check it out. You can go to radical like Jesus on Amazon anywhere books can be sold. Greg Steer.com I had an opportunity to.
[01:14:52] Speaker C: Read that and it is amazing. I highly recommend it. Well, just to wrap up our election year episode, I think it's important to just remember that most of us listening on here, and all three of us are Americans and we're all three christians. Those overlap. There's no way those can't overlap. As a matter of fact, they're supposed to overlap. But God and country are not on the same level.
For Christians, our allegiance to goddess, God is everything. Our ultimate allegiance is to him. And I'm proud to pledge allegiance to the flag of America, but it's not on the same level of pledging allegiance to God and to his word. And the gospel is always going to be the focus of our lives as Christians. And the gospel should always be the focus of our church gatherings, not waving to flags of countries and not saying pledges of allegiance, but preaching the gospel, because that's the only thing that's going to change. And there may come a time where we can't pledge allegiance to America if it reaches a point like Rome did, like the roman empire did, where it's against our faith. But Romans chapter 13 does tell us that we are to honor governing authorities and that God ultimately sets up every authority that exists. He's the one that appoints them and he's the one that will reward them and punish them. So we are called to pay our taxes. We're called, to be honest, we're called to honor our government leaders. But my ultimate allegiance is to Jesus. And that is the defining mark of my life. And I think it always should be.
[01:16:44] Speaker B: And, you know, the fact of the matter is, throughout history, the church has shined the brightest when the world was at its darkest.
[01:16:53] Speaker C: Amen.
[01:16:54] Speaker B: And so we have to stop. And again, I'm concerned, genuinely concerned about the climate and the future of America. But my hope is not in the White House. And so I think that's a great, great way to summarize. And, of course, we've said that, but it's the reality that we live with that our kingdom is not of this world. And as the Jews cried at Golgotha, we have no king but Caesar. Our cry should be, we have no king but Jesus.
And it's important that we keep that at the centerpiece of our hearts.
[01:17:34] Speaker A: Amen.
[01:17:35] Speaker C: Yeah. I also want to challenge everybody to go look at the republican platform. It's online. Read it. It's a lot of pages, but read it. The democratic platform. Read it. I read them today, went back over it. We didn't obviously, have time to get into that. But, guys, one of those resonates way more with me, just as an american, than the other one does. And when it gets to LGBTQ issues and pro life and things like that, there's a hard line between the two parties, and I just challenge people to go read those and know what it is that you're voting for and put a lot of prayer into it, and then call me and I'll tell you who to vote for.
[01:18:26] Speaker A: All right, boys. Well, what a good episode. Hopefully our listeners, at least some of them, will come back to episode 181, and it'll be Matt Dudley's third episode. They say after this third episode, the fourth one comes, so that should be fun. And we'll hit episode number 181. That was my dad joke for the day right there. It was terrible. It was a lot better, and it.
[01:18:46] Speaker B: Was worse than Nathan. So congratulations.
[01:18:49] Speaker A: There we go. Hey. Make plans to join us for the sake of the gospel the very first weekend in November, and we hope to see you here in Ringle, Georgia, for that conference there. Sign up for Israel, go to recovering fundamentalist.org, click on the Israel tab and sign up today. And we still have a merch store. You can still get the Brian visor even though Brian's not here anymore.
Go do it. Sell it out. It'll be great. Boys, I love you. Have a great week.
[01:19:17] Speaker B: Love you guys.
[01:19:22] Speaker C: Peace.
[01:19:22] Speaker B: Hey.
Hey. I still don't have a catchphrase at the end.
[01:19:28] Speaker A: You need to get.
No, no cap.
[01:19:31] Speaker B: No cap.
[01:19:33] Speaker A: Gibbony, Ohio. Riz. That's it. Thanks for listening to the Recovering Fundamentalist podcast. Be sure to stop by our social media, Facebook, Instagram, and Twitter. Give us a follow. Also, go to our website, recoveringfundamentalist.org. that's recoveringfundamentalist.org. there you can find recovering fundamentalist swag. You can get your t shirts and hats. You can join our ex fundy community, see where we're gonna be having some meetups. It's the recovery recoveringfundamentalist.org dot. Be sure to join us next time for the recovering fundamentalist podcast.
